The recent spate of celebrity deaths and some spirited discussions on the blog about guilty pleasures and musical mystification suggests an interesting topic: As music fans, how much do we care about the musical preferences, personal philosophies or other opinions of popular artists whose work we admire?
A frequent right-wing put-down of (generally liberal) celebrities is, “Shut up and sing.” Is there a grain of truth in that slogan? Or is it the responsibility of popular figures to use their celebrity to champion what they think is right?
Now let’s get personal: Patrick Works a while back polled us about famous folk we admire. Moving that discussion into the present tense, are there recent or current creative figures whose musical or political opinions you value?
Can you pan someone’s art but admire their views? And vice versa?
Caravaggio’s paintings are so stunning that, immediately after learning about them, I filled my apartment with prints. Then I read a few bios. He was not just a jerk, but a murderer. His was a genius who could depict innocence and joy with oil on canvas. I still love those prints and see originals any chance I get.
Walt Whitman has some deep, deep issues but yet I find that he speaks, screams, such human truths I cannot help but admire his loving embracing of human imperfection.
I should probably have written that in the past tense. He is a dead white man after all.
Lewis Carroll. Wouldn’t use him as a life consultant. Love his books.
Why compromise? What you are, you do. What you do, you are.
Abusa’id Abolkhayr.
http://www.superluminal.com/cookbook/essay_abil_khayr.html
http://www.poetry-chaikhana.com/A/AbilKheirAbu/index.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ab%C5%AB-Sa%27%C4%ABd_Abul-Khayr
If someone plays music and I admire them, of course Im curious to hear what they think about music and things that have influenced their music. But I think it’s obnoxious when celebrities take advantage of the fact that they have a microphone in front of them to spout off about their political beliefs. Why would anyone care what celebrities think about that subject?
I am more interested in Leonard Cohen’s spiritual views than his music. He frequently appears in the Buddhist publication “The Shambhala Sun” and I appreciate his insight as a dharma practitioner. I thank other celebrities for their perspective as well.
http://www.shambhalasun.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2106
Hillary Duff’s oeuvre inspired me to research how a woman of such tender youth could tap such wisdom. Her connection with the universal rhythm of man inspires me.
(megan… i wish i hadn’t had a mouthful of water when i read that…)
::cleans laptop and curses you::
Sun Ra. Not a role model, but an example of an artist for whom there seemed to be no separation between his personal beliefs and his art.
As liberal Democrats, Jon Bon Jovi and John Mellencamp both stopped the McCain campaign from using their songs. Michael Bolton drives on the left side. And then of course there are the Dixie Chicks.
While somebody more conscientious than I may have found gleaming facets to these folks’ musical careers (looking to Paul Howland for guidance), everything I’ve heard suggests that none of these four acts will ever be my cup of tea. All of them are oriented in the general political direction I support, though. And the first two were reacting directly to attempts by the other guys to co-opt their music for their own political agenda.
Sooooooooooo … Is it bad for them to speak up? Is it worse for them to (arguably) suck? Is it bad to tell people whose politics you don’t like not to use your material?
Some people have argued that Hollywood played at least a supporting role in preparing this country for a beige president (admittedly after many decades casting African-Americans as domestic servants). And I think that maybe the rapid changes in recognition of gay rights from generation to generation has something to do with mass media. (Ellen DeGeneres as a comedian is something I don’t get, although she’s an innocuous enough personality … But in some ways, the fact that she is so middle of the road is kind of a triumph in itself. Maybe?)
I do find myself less and less interested in the political views of celebrities — except when they bum me out. (I liked Mel Gibson in some movies!) It’s hard for me to think that famous people in one area have any special insights about other areas. I figure I could explore those subjects in more interesting ways with people I know personally or by going to the same source material that these famous folk end up quoting (or misquoting). Same goes for their musical opinions, as we discussed back in the “Guilty pleasures” thread.
But then, some art I like is political. Woody Guthrie, Ledbelly, Bertolt Brecht, Crass … Dunno if they’d be the same without the politics.
Besides Adam Yauch, Richard Gere, Alice Walker, Maya Angelou, as well as Allen Ginsberg and Gary Snyder have shared valuable insights on meditation practice too.
Rudimentary Peni and the Dead Kennedys!
Sun Ra?
I’ll add Pharaoh Sanders
and Dr. Lonnie Smith, too.
Strange and wonderful cats.
Of course, if we are talking of unresolved contradictions by those of whom we are, still, struck by awe?
And more again:
i saw arthue lee & love…..i believe open for lou reed nearly 30-odd years ago.
amazing he was that night even if he was already well-past his prime.
as for heroes, musical and spiritual…..and thusly perhaps even political…i’d have to say peter gabriel and brian eno.
(i know i know* thusly> is not a word but please forgive me while i pretend).
i’m very tempted to start a thread on these 2 pioneers and discuss how they shaped the sounds and attitudes and ideas permeating ANY discussion involving modern music and it’s role in the social and aesthetic mores of our times.
both of these artists understood 2 things which they held in common……1) that high-brow and low-brow aesthetics were often interchangeable and with reason…..2) that words were often limited in their usefulness when it came to conveying the deeper-nature of human-nature…that sound was it’s own element and had every right to exist as such without needing to put literal translation or meaning onto it…
Clay,
I think eno is woven into many threads on Che. I, for one, would warmly welcome an insightful “This We Dug” feature on the front page about eno -- with maybe many things that are lesser-known or little understood.
Now, for another tribute to an admired figure, who’s life or beliefs I’d not imitate -- but who’s perception and ethos make me again swear that “There, but for the grace of God, go I”…
Mr. Carlin:
the man was fairly-crazed and funny-as-hell…does that mean we should care what he had to say about god or religion or who owns and runs this country??#?!?!?!!%$#!
hell yeah we should!
sometimes it’s the only way people can hear anything…through the safety-net of laughter.
>>”But in some ways, the fact that she is so middle of the road is kind of a triumph in itself. Maybe?” (Ellen)
Very insightful Matt. Also love Dixie Chicks and all the other people that used their celebrity to help put an end to that idiot Bush.
I would say that Bob Marley was a huge inspiration…lots of groovy love. Just the opening minute or so of Rastaman Vibration makes you feel a new warmth and optimism.
Again, though, he wasn’t much of a Dad or Husband.
Anything ENO…all the time. Love him, but don’t see him as a real inspiration or role model…just a great artist.
Yeah Jeremiah and Clay… George Carlin all the way. He really points out our own ridiculous views on religion and politics.
bruce>i wasn’t thinking specifically in terms of inspiration or role-model, but yeah….i could run with that. have you heard eno’s ANOTHER DAY ON EARTH…..? it REALLY is a thing of beauty on a number of counts…..and he sings sings sings!!!
we’re talking about a guy who at one time wasn’t necessarily IN THE spotlight the way bowie or iggy might’ve been…but it was HIS energy and influence which WAS THE spotlight in which they shined (low, heroes, the idiot).
eno’s even having graced his vibe on the LAMB LIES DOWN ON BROADWAY….that was a tremendous link between two seemingly disparate schools of music.
and it’s worth noting that it was early gabriel-period genesis which helped inspire johnny lydon to want to become johnny rotten…..listen to BACK IN NYC and you can hear a foretelling of punk-rock in the way the ramones comic-bookish renderings just did not come anywhere close to.
anyway…inspiration….you turn around and decades later brian has about the same amount of hair…..(very little) but has that same quiet shining quality which allows his music to be so many different things to so many people.
i’m sorry he couldn’t help coldplay with their last effort…..except force them to stop hating each other for two minutes so as to be able to garner a ridiculous amount of rewards.
sorry to say but that album makes my blood stop.
Nice blurb on ENO…always loved his music from day 1. I like his singing, “Here we are, stuck by this river…”, his instrumental and “Ambient” music, and most of the collaborative stuff.
Want “Spider and I” at my funeral.
Coldplay leaves me cold.
funny story:
karl irving and i were in europe for the summer in 1987. we went to see ub40, the pogues and u2 at a racetrack outside paris. after the show we watched as everyone left and then decided to try to meet them all. so we walked to the backstage area and sort of loitered. at one point this man walked up to me and we started chatting. he was nice enough, funny, smart… and he asked us if we wanted to meet the bands. of course we said yes. so we followed him to the entrance to the hospitality tent and met and greeted several of the evenings performers. as we were walking away i turned to the first man who had chatted us up and brought us back and introduced myself. he said, “lovely to meet you both, the name’s brian…”
as we were walking back toward paris after refusing a ride (wtf was that??? a limo back to the hotel 7K away v. walking all that way and we said no???) karl and i realized that that man was none other than mister eno. we were too blinded by our desire to meet the more popular musicians that we completely didn’t register who we had been talking to. at home we had, between us, almost everything he had done. HE was who we should have been talking to, not bono.
yeah, we both cringe still. at least i know i do. karl?
my hero/inspiration is karen finley. she’s amazing. seeing her perform created in me a need to do performance art, which i did, as much as possible, back in the 90’s and into the 2000’s. and diamanda galas. what a voice.
(btw, is anyone else getting the banner on our page which proclaims we can “get ann coulter, free!” i find it hilarious.)
>>is anyone else getting the banner on our page which proclaims we can “get ann coulter, free!
Ava: I got “Free Newt”! For Gingrich’s newsletter … But I thought at first it was like Sea Monkeys.
I’m going to tell an Allen Ginsberg story to help explain why I liked him personally more than many of his peers: Allen was counterculture, for sure … but I also found him very sensible and centered, resisting hyperbole with wit and kindness.
My folks took Allen to an Italian place in Hillcrest, I think in ’85. Other people joined them, including me and a couple of friends.
At our table was a reporter for a gay newspaper (I forget which) — very intense; not humorous at all; very focused on the AIDS crisis (extra-understandable, since he revealed that his own brother had died of the disease). And he was trying strenuously to get Allen to endorse the notion that the Reagan administration had introduced AIDS as a genocide bomb against the gay community.
Now, it would have been easy for Allen to play the counterculture-warrior card, especially for the press; even if he didn’t concur with this AIDS theory as fact, he could have used it as an easy opportunity to say something dark and ominous about Reagan. He could have humored this man; he could have dismissed him and declined to engage.
Instead, after listening politely to the interviewer, Allen very gently said, “This idea really doesn’t make any sense. Do you see?” Then he very carefully reviewed the best current lay knowledge of the epidemic’s history; he clearly had read the literature, he wasn’t setting himself up as an expert, he wasn’t putting this very upset man down in any way — and he definitely wasn’t willing to play the easy role of anti-establishment Beatnik rabble rouser.
He spent a while on his answer. He never raised his voice. And he never took away the interviewer’s dignity. (I assume the guy was disappointed his hero didn’t embrace his view, but he couldn’t say Allen wasn’t attentive and respectful. I can’t imagine a kinder or better-considered rejoinder.)
Really left an impression on me. And yeah, it did help model my own rhetorical style.
Spuds McKenzie
mister ginsberg always impressed me as a very good man. this just confirms it.
dylan… ha!
I’d nominate Gordon Parks
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gordon_Parks
He’s interesting as he’s actually a balanced individual, with a personal life that’s pretty complimentary to his prolific art.
Strange…I didn’t know anybody but me was so damned perfect!
LOL
Patrick Works
Has no mustache
matt…if you can help me figure out how to embed a picture or vid into one of these posts that’d be nifty
patrick works
not a geek
still no mustache
>>matt…if you can help me figure out how to embed a picture or vid into one of these posts that’d be nifty
Patrick: I’ll kibbitz with you offline. 🙂
anyone
with nappy hair
would make a
fine role model
i look
to the
young people
of our universe
they
are the hope
nappy head or not
missed you
pat and jerry
and
my kids missed
you too
>>i look
to the
young people
of our universe
Louie: My kids have taught me worlds.
Matthew and Louie: The child is the father of the man.
A good question is whether or not people should be looking to entertainers as role models at all. There are good, admirable people all around us. Fame, money and power corrupt to an extent that it becomes very difficult for a celebrity to be a decent human being.
To answer the question about how important it is for celebrities to use their fame as a “bully pulpit,” much of what passes for celebrity endorsement of social and political issues is nothing more than attention whoring. I can start to take an actor, musician or athlete seriously on an issue when I know that he or she contributes a significant amount of time or money to that cause. There are some great examples of people who have used their celebrity for good, but unfortunately, in the wake of any tragedy many public figures are lining up to be seen on camera.
If I admire a musician for his or her talent, it makes little sense to me to take his or her recommendation on a particular ballot initiative. Even some of the most outspoken artists are really quite ill-informed and inarticulate about political and social issues. It is often embarrassing to listen to them. Do I really need to be lectured about global warming by Leonardo Di Caprio? Does his over –acting give him an increased understanding of the dangers of chlorofluorocarbons? Chuck Norris told me to vote for John McCain—does he possess any special political insight as a result of making crappy movies?
I’m content to admire musicians for their talent and not expect them to be saints nor sages in their personal lives.
>>Do I really need to be lectured about global warming by Leonardo Di Caprio?
Ray: Did you see “Titanic”? What part of “giant iceberg” don’t you understand??
Ray -- while I agree with you, in large part, about celebrities putting their money where their mouths are, I also see a great social benefit here too.
I don’t think, as you’ve stated, that they are any more INFORMED because of their celebrity, but, because they do have the public’s “ear”, I believe they can be a great vehicle for change.
I think Hollywood does keep a liberal agenda going and has helped with anti-war efforts, ecology, world hunger, AIDS, and elections.
I guess it depends on where you stand politically, but I’m glad for the Paul Newmans, Leonardo Di Caprios, Jane Fondas,… even Ed Begley. A general public that is inherently ignorant of most social issues may benefit from a wake up call…even if it is from Hollywood.
GODWIN!
“easy as 1-2-3…”
When we fight Godwin’s Law, Godwin’s Law loses.
Adolf Hitler: Frustrated Imagineer?
He wasn’t the worst painter I ever saw …
Hitler art…yay!!
i was surprised by how little the work actually commanded. i guess there are fewer today who actually feel comfortable putting their money where their mouth was at one time.
Very funny stuff Jeremiah.
I still can’t get over the loss of my first and foremost media hero
oops…embed didn’t work
try this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=810TQyT2KXI
long may he live